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Post by bigbarney on May 2, 2021 12:09:17 GMT -5
 My wife's laptop has steadfastly refused to update beyond 1909 installed on 17/06/2019.
I have made at least 15 attempts to upgrade to 20H2 but although it goes through the complete cycle of downloading and then installing, the installation fails every time.
My computer magazine suggests Downloading and installing the update(s) via the Update Assistant and I have considered this but there are several warnings on the Assistant page about possible problems due to hardware issues.
I am reluctant to try this method but also aware that after May 2021, the laptop will be vulnerable to security issues, if it remains on 1909.
HELP!
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Post by jholland1964 on May 2, 2021 12:23:21 GMT -5
How old is the computer? Did the computer come with Windows 10? Are you positive there is enough space for the updates? You have obviously missed quite a few. What hardware issues are you concerned about? Personally I would suggest that you follow the instructions given here |
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Post by bigbarney on May 2, 2021 12:45:29 GMT -5
I don't know what hardware issues might give problems, I'm only going by the warnings given on the Assistant site.
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Post by jholland1964 on May 2, 2021 12:55:21 GMT -5
I don't know what hardware issues might give problems, I'm only going by the warnings given on the Assistant site. I looked through it all and honestly didn't see anything about hardware issues unless we aren't looking at the same page. You do have all security programs turned off don't you? |
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Post by bigbarney on May 2, 2021 13:03:10 GMT -5
I was looking at the site recommended by my magazine.
I will try again using the guidance given on your link.
It will be later this evening though, right now Jean is ordering her weekly groceries!
I'll keep you posted with progress.
Thanks Judy.
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Post by jholland1964 on May 2, 2021 13:04:56 GMT -5
You're welcome. I have always had very good results using instructions from the web site I gave you.
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Post by bigbarney on May 2, 2021 13:18:49 GMT -5
Incidentally, our old laptop, which came originally with Windows 7 installed has been upgraded to Windows 8 then 10 and has all the updates to 20H2 installed with no problems whatsoever!
I keep it as a spare.
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Post by budgall on May 2, 2021 13:58:57 GMT -5
I also think you should follow Judy's suggestion, however I would suggest you make a clone backup of your current system first. Just in case.
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Post by Everton on May 2, 2021 20:29:16 GMT -5
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Post by bigbarney on May 3, 2021 3:09:33 GMT -5
You're welcome. I have always had very good results using instructions from the web site I gave you. I followed all the steps in the Assistant and the laptop was classed as suitable for upgrade. I went to bed and left it to it, it went through all the screens which I expected to see and the installation began.
Checked this morning and once again the installation has failed. The main frustration is that there are no clues given as to why it keeps failing!
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Post by Everton on May 3, 2021 7:39:45 GMT -5
You have not said if you used the Troubleshooter ? Even if it can not fix whatever the issue is it may be able to say what is the cause.
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Post by bigbarney on May 3, 2021 12:27:41 GMT -5
You have not said if you used the Troubleshooter ? Even if it can not fix whatever the issue is it may be able to say what is the cause. Hi Eve,
I haven't had time to check the Troubleshooter yet. Our gas boiler has broken down and we have no hot water or heating during a cold spell here. It's a only about 6 degrees and wet outside. The boiler is covered by a maintenance agreement but they can't come till Thursday.....brrrrrr! House full of fan heaters but no way of getting hot water other than boiling kettles.
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Post by jholland1964 on May 3, 2021 12:49:40 GMT -5
Barney have you never received an error code through all of this? Have you looked at the Update History? It may tell you why this is happening or at least give you a clue.
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Post by budgall on May 3, 2021 13:26:06 GMT -5
Barney
There is a long discussion about updating from 1909 on the askwoody.com website. You may want to check it out, perhaps a solution may be found there.
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Post by Everton on May 3, 2021 15:30:16 GMT -5
You have not said if you used the Troubleshooter ? Even if it can not fix whatever the issue is it may be able to say what is the cause. Hi Eve,
I haven't had time to check the Troubleshooter yet. Our gas boiler has broken down and we have no hot water or heating during a cold spell here. It's a only about 6 degrees and wet outside. The boiler is covered by a maintenance agreement but they can't come till Thursday.....brrrrrr! House full of fan heaters but no way of getting hot water other than boiling kettles.
Ooh Brrrrr. Hope the boiler gets fixed soon. It must be like being in the ‘old days’ for what’s it’s worth I have used the Troubleshooter on two occasions on my laptop (admittedly not for majority upgrades) and both times it has fixed the problem. It’s automatic, just runs by itself and then shows a report on what it has found and whether or not it has been corrected. Takes only minutes. Stay warm ! |
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Post by Everton on May 4, 2021 9:24:39 GMT -5
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Post by bigbarney on May 4, 2021 13:39:13 GMT -5
I am very aware that time is running out for updates, that is the reason for my original post.
Few other things on my mind too!
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Post by jholland1964 on May 4, 2021 13:58:25 GMT -5
Barney have you never received an error code through all of this?
Have you looked at the Update History? It may tell you why this is happening or at least give you a clue.
As Eve said the Troubleshooter also just takes a very few minutes to run.
As we've often said, we cannot really compare computers and what they do or don't do. Even though something works ok on several, i.e. this one and your wife's doesn't mean it will work on yours without doing some "detective" work
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Post by bigbarney on May 5, 2021 0:48:54 GMT -5
Judy,
The Troublshooter finds no problems.
The error code shown is 0x1900101
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Post by jholland1964 on May 5, 2021 8:25:56 GMT -5
Judy,
The Troublshooter finds no problems.
The error code shown is 0x1900101
Is that the full error number? There "may be" 7 additional ones which would make it read similarly to this;
Those last seven would or could be different of course. At any rate, even when the Troubleshooter indicates no problem, that part you have posted normally indicate a driver or space problem.
1. Make sure that your device has enough space. Your device requires at least 16 GB of free space to upgrade a 32-bit OS, or 20 GB for a 64-bit OS.
2. Make sure that ALL other updates are installed. Including any other Windows updates. Download and install any available updates in Windows Update, including software updates, hardware updates, and some third-party drivers.
3. Download and install any other available updates in Windows Update, including software updates, hardware updates, and some third-party drivers.
4. Unplug extra hardware. Remove all external storage devices and drives, docks, printers and other hardware you might have plugged into your device that isn’t needed for basic functionality.
5. Check Device Manager for errors. Select the Start button, then in the search box on the taskbar, type device manager. Choose Device Manager from the results. In the window that pops up, look for any device with a yellow exclamation mark beside it (you may have to select each category to switch to the list of devices). Press and hold (or right-click) the device name and select either Update Driver Software or Uninstall to correct the errors.
6. Remove third-party security software. Make sure you know how to reinstall your programs and that any necessary product keys are on hand. Windows Defender will help protect your device in the meantime.
7. Repair hard-drive errors. Select the Start button, then in the search box on the taskbar, type command prompt. Choose Command Prompt from the list of results. In the window that pops up, type chkdsk/f C: and press the Enter key. Repairs automatically start on your hard drive, and you’ll be asked to restart your device.
9. Restore and repair system files. Select the Start button, then in the search box on the taskbar, type command prompt. Choose Command Prompt from the list of results. In the window that pops up, type DISM.exe /Online /Cleanup-image /Restorehealth and press the Enter key. (Learn to repair a Windows image)
You also should go through ALL of your installed software and make sure it is all up to date. If it cannot be updated any longer then the recommendation is to remove it because this also can cause upgrade failures.
These recommendations should all be done in order. These are the recommendations from Microsoft and other than those I have no others.
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Post by bigbarney on May 6, 2021 3:59:58 GMT -5
Judy,
The Troublshooter finds no problems.
The error code shown is 0x1900101
Is that the full error number? There "may be" 7 additional ones which would make it read similarly to this;
Those last seven would or could be different of course. At any rate, even when the Troubleshooter indicates no problem, that part you have posted normally indicate a driver or space problem.
1. Make sure that your device has enough space. Your device requires at least 16 GB of free space to upgrade a 32-bit OS, or 20 GB for a 64-bit OS.
2. Make sure that ALL other updates are installed. Including any other Windows updates. Download and install any available updates in Windows Update, including software updates, hardware updates, and some third-party drivers.
3. Download and install any other available updates in Windows Update, including software updates, hardware updates, and some third-party drivers.
4. Unplug extra hardware. Remove all external storage devices and drives, docks, printers and other hardware you might have plugged into your device that isn’t needed for basic functionality.
5. Check Device Manager for errors. Select the Start button, then in the search box on the taskbar, type device manager. Choose Device Manager from the results. In the window that pops up, look for any device with a yellow exclamation mark beside it (you may have to select each category to switch to the list of devices). Press and hold (or right-click) the device name and select either Update Driver Software or Uninstall to correct the errors.
6. Remove third-party security software. Make sure you know how to reinstall your programs and that any necessary product keys are on hand. Windows Defender will help protect your device in the meantime.
7. Repair hard-drive errors. Select the Start button, then in the search box on the taskbar, type command prompt. Choose Command Prompt from the list of results. In the window that pops up, type chkdsk/f C: and press the Enter key. Repairs automatically start on your hard drive, and you’ll be asked to restart your device.
9. Restore and repair system files. Select the Start button, then in the search box on the taskbar, type command prompt. Choose Command Prompt from the list of results. In the window that pops up, type DISM.exe /Online /Cleanup-image /Restorehealth and press the Enter key. (Learn to repair a Windows image)
You also should go through ALL of your installed software and make sure it is all up to date. If it cannot be updated any longer then the recommendation is to remove it because this also can cause upgrade failures.
These recommendations should all be done in order. These are the recommendations from Microsoft and other than those I have no others.
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Post by jholland1964 on May 6, 2021 7:55:07 GMT -5
No message from you in your last reply Barney. Just a full quote of my previous message. I see you have Norton 360 listed. That could very well be your problem. As said several times first on the reference page I gave you first from tenforums and then on the latest one directly from Microsoft:
As has been said many, many times on this forum since the release of Windows 10, the use of a 3rd party AV program is truly not necessary and may cause many problems. Windows Defender is EXCELLENT, BUILT IN and FREE. I have used nothing else since the purchase of my very first Windows 10 when it was first released. I have also purchased three others in recent years for my grandchildren and none of them have a 3rd party AV installed and all have continued to be infection free.
It may be you have Norton's on all three of the computers running Windows 10 but it is truly not necessary. Yes, you said the others have done the upgrade without difficulty and likely with Norton's on them but as said previously, every computer is different and what works with one may very well not work with others.
Follow all of the instructions I posted and you have quoted above, especially the TOTAL UNINSTALL of any 3rd party Security programs.
Also, do you have fast boot/startup enabled. If so and you are shutting down and not using the "Restart' function then that could possibly be a problem too. You need to be using Restart when told do do a reboot because if you do not then everything is not shutting down as it should when doing updates or program uninstalls.
Try again.
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Post by bigbarney on May 6, 2021 12:27:49 GMT -5
Hi Judy,
Up until now I have been disabling Norton before trying to update Windows.
Yesterday, I totally uninstalled Norton using Norton's removal tool.
I have since tried multiple times to update with no success. I have worked my through the recommended steps which you posted with no problems reported. The only step which I have not tried is step 8, clean restart.
I have attached a screen shot of the update history of the offending laptop, which incidentally, I am using to post this message.
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Post by jholland1964 on May 6, 2021 12:57:46 GMT -5
Why have you not done the clean restart? A “clean boot” starts Windows with a minimal set of drivers and startup programs, so that you can determine whether a background program is interfering with your game or program. This is similar to starting Windows in Safe Mode, but provides you more control over which services and programs run at startup to help you isolate the cause of a problem. If you had done this you could have gotten your answer or have been able to do the upgrade. Steps are given for a good reason not to keep people busy.
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Post by bigbarney on May 6, 2021 13:14:49 GMT -5
Why have you not done the clean restart? A “clean boot” starts Windows with a minimal set of drivers and startup programs, so that you can determine whether a background program is interfering with your game or program. This is similar to starting Windows in Safe Mode, but provides you more control over which services and programs run at startup to help you isolate the cause of a problem. If you had done this you could have gotten your answer or have been able to do the upgrade. Steps are given for a good reason not to keep people busy.
Just doing the clean boot now. |
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Post by bigbarney on May 7, 2021 4:36:54 GMT -5
Judy, My apologies for not being able to give this situation my full attention but I have been dealing with other home issues.
I have followed all the steps without any success. No problems with hardware or disk problems apparently.
When I followed the 'clean boot' process, I assumed that all unnecessary programs and apps would be shut down, but Malwarebytes was till running and also Open Shell was still the default.
The result is that I am no further forward with updates on the machine.
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Post by jholland1964 on May 7, 2021 8:10:31 GMT -5
Judy, My apologies for not being able to give this situation my full attention but I have been dealing with other home issues.
I have followed all the steps without any success. No problems with hardware or disk problems apparently.
When I followed the 'clean boot' process, I assumed that all unnecessary programs and apps would be shut down, but Malwarebytes was till running and also Open Shell was still the default.
The result is that I am no further forward with updates on the machine.
Barney, YOU must turn the items off yourself. It doesn't happen automatically. 1st you Hide Microsoft Services and then remove checkmarks from all that remain, Malwarebytes would be listed there. Then you go to Start Up Manager and Disable All Start Ups. I know for sure that Open Shell is listed there so it must be disabled.
See Attachments
If Open Shell and Malwarebytes' were running when the Clean Boot was fully up than that means that You did not disable them.
Plus, you were told in all instructions that 3rd party Security Programs should be turned off. Sounds to me like you never have turned off Malwarebytes, when upgrades were attempted. Besides your Norton EVERY OTHER Security program you have installed must also be either turned off or uninstalled. All 3rd party security programs have been known to cause upgrade or update problems.
Attachments:
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Post by jholland1964 on May 7, 2021 9:40:17 GMT -5
Hi Judy,
Up until now I have been disabling Norton before trying to update Windows.
Yesterday, I totally uninstalled Norton using Norton's removal tool.
I have since tried multiple times to update with no success. I have worked my through the recommended steps which you posted with no problems reported. The only step which I have not tried is step 8, clean restart.
I have attached a screen shot of the update history of the offending laptop, which incidentally, I am using to post this message.
Barney, I am somewhat confused here. You said that you removed Norton's on May 5 and since then have tried multiple times to install the upgrade and all failed. Yet, your attached shows only day attempts were made to upgrade were done on that day.
1909 was released in Nov. 2019 but you didn't install it until January 2020. Version 2004 was not officially released to the public until May 2020 but you show the attempts being made in January & March 2020 so you were trying to take the early release and then after release you tried multiple times and it failed. Now 20H2 was released in Oct. 2020. Your first attempt was once in Feb. 2021, twice in March and then the ones tried after the Norton Removal. I don't see any other multiple attempts.
There also have been other multiple updates released each month, you show none of those. We are talking LOTS of other updates. Don't you have Automatic Updates on there as there should be?? That obviously is not working.
There is definitely some sort of problem with the computer, IF you have followed all the instructions fully and automatic updates are running correctly. You may have some system files that are corrupt and you should try to check and see if that is the case and then fix them.
I would strongly recommend that you run the System File checker to see if you can find and fix corrupted files.
If that is not successful then either take the computer to a shop and ask them to fix it or give this one up and use the older one that you say has all updates and works well.
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Post by bigbarney on May 7, 2021 11:55:47 GMT -5
Judy, My apologies for not being able to give this situation my full attention but I have been dealing with other home issues.
I have followed all the steps without any success. No problems with hardware or disk problems apparently.
When I followed the 'clean boot' process, I assumed that all unnecessary programs and apps would be shut down, but Malwarebytes was till running and also Open Shell was still the default.
The result is that I am no further forward with updates on the machine.
Barney, YOU must turn the items off yourself. It doesn't happen automatically. 1st you Hide Microsoft Services and then remove checkmarks from all that remain, Malwarebytes would be listed there. Then you go to Start Up Manager and Disable All Start Ups. I know for sure that Open Shell is listed there so it must be disabled.
See Attachments
If Open Shell and Malwarebytes' were running when the Clean Boot was fully up than that means that You did not disable them.
Plus, you were told in all instructions that 3rd party Security Programs should be turned off. Sounds to me like you never have turned off Malwarebytes, when upgrades were attempted. Besides your Norton EVERY OTHER Security program you have installed must also be either turned off or uninstalled. All 3rd party security programs have been known to cause upgrade or update problems.
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Post by bigbarney on May 7, 2021 11:59:39 GMT -5
Believe me Judy that I did follow all the directions and ticked all the correct boxes while setting up the reboot. I disabled all start ups including Open shell. Why they were still running is beyond me.
I think a new laptop is on the horizon.
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My wife's laptop has steadfastly refused to update beyond 1909 installed on 17/06/2019.
